Union Hall Transcript

Sisters, Brothers, and Siblings,

Thank you to everyone who joined us for our first-ever telephone town hall. It was powerful to hear your voices, your questions, and your commitment. Even with a few technical bumps, what stood out most was our unity.

We are being heard. We are organizing. And we are gaining strength with every step.

This transcript is here to keep you informed, because staying connected is how we stay strong. We’re in this together, and together, we will win the contract we deserve.

Be safe. Stay united. We Ride Together.

— Noah Vineberg
President, ATU Local 279

Chères sœurs et chers frères

Merci à toutes et à tous d’avoir participé à notre toute première assemblée publique téléphonique. Ce fut un moment fort de vous entendre, de recevoir vos questions, et de ressentir votre engagement. Malgré quelques défis techniques, ce qui ressort avant tout, c’est notre unité.

Nous sommes entendus. Nous nous organisons. Et nous gagnons en force à chaque étape.

Cette transcription vous est partagée pour que vous restiez bien informées — car rester connectées, c’est rester fortes. Nous sommes ensemble dans ce combat, et ensemble, nous obtiendrons le contrat que nous méritons.

Prenez soin de vous. Restons unis. Nous roulons ensemble.

— Noah Vineberg
Président, ATU section locale 279

The following is a transcript from the call. Any questions that were in the queue have been answered and included. Thank you.

- Well, hello and welcome to our live forum with ATU Local 279. Just a few folks on

right now, but we will be finished dialling out in just about 30 seconds here. We'll

hear from the President of ATU Local 279, Noah Vineberg. So, thank you for joining us, and 

we are again dialling out to local 279 members right now. As you listen, think

about questions you'd like to ask after our updates. And as soon as you have a

question to submit, press zero to get that question to an operator. You can ask

your question live, or let your operator know if you want me to read your

question instead. Whatever is more comfortable for you is fine with us. I'll repeat

this once more as we finish our dial-out to ATU Local 279 members. Again,

welcome. This is a live forum, and we're about to hear from the President of ATU Local

279 Noah Vineberg. Thank you for joining us, and as you listen tonight, think about

questions you'd like to ask after our updates. As soon as you have a question

in mind, submit that question to an operator by pressing zero. They'll take down some

notes on your question. We'd love to take your question live if you're comfortably

going live. If not, just let your operator know that you want me to read your

question, and that's perfectly fine too. In either case, again, you just press zero to

get your questions to an operator tonight. So once again, this is a live forum. We

are just finishing our dial-out now. We're going to go to the President of ATU Local

279, Noah Vineberg. If you have any questions for him as we go tonight, press zero

to get it into the queue. And with that, it's my pleasure to kick off this live

forum by turning it over to the President of ATU Local 279, Noah Vineberg. Noah, please

go ahead. - Thank you, Kylie. Good evening, sisters, brothers, and links. Welcome to

our first tele-town hall. I am joined by international vice president, Manny Sforza,

and we are holding this town hall because we know that it is crucial to keep every

member updated about the state of our negotiations and our campaign for a great

contract. First, I will be going into some important report backs about the actions

that you, the membership, have taken so far and that have sent a strong message to

management that we are serious about winning a strong contract. Second, I would like

to talk about the next steps regarding our upcoming events that we will hold to

further pressure the decision-makers.  International, IVP Sforza and I will give an

update on bargaining, how the first two meetings have gone and what our key

priorities are in terms of proposals and what the tone at the table has been like.

Finally, we will have a Q &A session at the end, so if you have any questions,

Please wait until the end to ask those questions. So first, I'd like to give you

a petition update. I'd like to start by speaking to the demand petition that many

of you signed over a two-month period this February and March. 75 % of you, in our 

membership,  have signed our local's petition to show OC Transpo that we stand together in our demand for a great contract. That was 185 members in total.

Apart from our strike years ago, our union has never had that level of participation

in any single coordinated action.  I just wanted to say bravo and thank you to

each of you who have signed it, and especially those of you who have helped to

circulate it. I'm proud not only for the sheer numbers who took part, but also that

every single department was engaged in super majorities. equipment, bus operators,

DRO, ERO, dispatchers, fare inspectors, and the Para fleet.

Every department had between 75 % to 90 % participation in our petition. The demands

that were written on the petition all stem from your input. The main demands on the

petition were higher wages, fair compensation for training, higher shift premiums,

increased tool and clothing allowances, improved run scheduling, increased prime time

vacation allotment, and better health and safety, including the ventilation in the

garage, and additional flex benefits for all of our members and their families. These

are the top-line demands we seek to gain from this round of contract

negotiations. Our power to win these demands will come from us standing in

solidarity with one another. There's an important reason we do not circulate multiple

petitions. One listing the demands for maintenance, another for drivers, another for

paratransit and so on. That reason is that we do not want that because our power

comes from our unity. From having 1,900 members saying that together, across each of

our departments, we are saying that with one voice that things need to change.

Back to the bargaining survey. You, the membership, have made it clear what your

priorities are. That is what guided what we highlighted on the petition demands and

what will guide us at the bargaining table. Last year, nearly 1,300 of our members,

roughly half, took part in a bargaining survey that we circulated,

excuse me,

that we circulated, where those were the key issues that were named by a majority.

In that survey, 84 % of the respondents stated that it is difficult to make ends

meet with our current wage rate and 41 % have found it so difficult that they have

been forced to take on a job. Seventy-one percent of you listed wages as your top

most number one priority for this contract. Scheduling came in as number two.

What is happening? Everybody's calling in on my other line. David, I don't know if

you can assist me with this.

In that survey, eighty-four percent responded that it was difficult to make ends meet

 and scheduling came in at number two, which makes sense, because 80 % of the

respondents stated that the current run schedules are completely unfeasible. This was

followed by benefits and paid time off as the fourth and fifth issues. Fundamentally,

this contract is about regaining some of our dignity, respect, and fairness on the

job. We heard you all loud and clear when 84 % of you stated in the bargaining

survey that management's concern for workers was poor and very bad. This is not just

about being paid fairly, expanding our benefits and improving our work-life balance.

This is about building power as a union and making sure that everyone has a dignified place to work once again. Tuesday, and on Thursday, May 28th, pardon me,

On May 28th, we will have the City Council meeting. We have gone over the demand

petition results and how that is tied with our next bargaining survey, and now we

will speak to some of the next steps. Next Wednesday, May 28th, our local will be

presenting our petition and all 1900 signatures on it to the City Council. We are doing

this because we want to go directly to the real decision makers who set the budget

and the transit priorities in Ottawa and make sure that they are put on notice

about our demands and our willingness to act in pursuit of these demands. For any

members who are not on duty that morning, I invite you to attend while wearing your

ATU T-shirts. Again, the City Council meeting is Wednesday, May 28th, at 10 a.m.

at City Hall on 110 Laurier Avenue West. If you are not scheduled to work, you are

invited to come and observe while wearing your ATU T-shirt. We are not allowed to

bring in signs, so please wear your shirts. Also, it is understood that all

attendees must remain respectful. There will be no talking. We will observe while

letting your ATU T-shirt and the petition speak for themselves. We will be sending 

a mass text reminding you of all the details, but now I would like the operator to

hold a poll so we can get a rough estimate of how many folks think they may

be able to attend. Operator, can you assist us with that poll, please? Sure thing,

Noah. We'll conduct that poll now. You can vote using your phone. So will you be

able to attend the upcoming City Council meeting at 10 a.m. on Wednesday, May 28,

at City Hall? Please remember that if you are scheduled to work during this time,

you should not attend. But our question for you is, will you be able to attend the

upcoming City Council meeting at 10 a.m. on Wednesday, May 28, at City Hall? Press

1 for yes, 2 for no, and 3 for maybe. Again, our question for you is,

will you be able to attend the upcoming City Council meeting at 10 a.m. on

Wednesday, May 28, at City Hall? Press 1 for yes, 2 for no, and 3 for maybe.

Again, please remember that if you're scheduled to work at that time, you

should not attend. And if you have a question that you'd like to line up for Noah

as he finishes his bargaining update in a moment here, you can press zero, get that

question to an operator. And then if you want to ask your question live, you're

welcome to do that. We already have Mustafa lined up with our first question. But

you're welcome to let your operator know if you want me to read your question

instead. In either case, press zero to get your question to an operator and

get in line for the Q&A that will follow this update. Noah, back to you.

Thank you very much. It will be great to have some of our members there. Send a

strong message to the City Council, and let's move on to the bargaining update portion of

this town hall. As you all know, our contract expired nearly two months ago on

March 31st. We served several formal notices to bargain on March 4th,

OSCE transfer gave us numerous assurances that they wanted to deal with and wrap up by June, and would be making time to meet with us promptly and regularly. 

To our frustration, when it came time to schedule bargaining dates,

OSCE transfer dragged its feet. Let me be clear, federal law states that an employer

has 20 days to meet after receiving the formal request. So OC Transpo broke the law when it blew past the deadline and kept us hanging until April 29th. There is no way to

start off our bargaining. It also sends a clear message to us that management is not

taking these problems seriously. It is not addressing our contract issues, which

affect service quality for our ridership and, in addition to ourselves and our

families, with the urgency that the situation demands. That is part of why we are

going directly to the City Council next week with our petition. Now, let us get into

some of the more of the details about the proposals, and in addition to the top line

demands that were listed on the petition, there are, of course, other language

issues that we'll be aiming to address in this contract. Other issues that we

brought to the proposal are booking issues, travel time, holidays, prime -time vacation

allotment, three -week primetime vacation pilot project to offer for junior

eligible employees through a lottery system Contracting out we want to tighten the

language around contracting out They have proposed to loosen it even further. They've

recently announced that they will be contract contracting out snow removal and

landscape. We have fought against this. We have raised. This is a very serious safety

and quality control issue. Regarding the language around health and safety committees, we need greater enforcement power and timelines, too, especially when it comes to

to including ventilation and problems in the garage. We've also requested in our

proposal to insert Para Transpo into the main body of our collective agreement in

order to achieve parity and have them be part of our contract going forward. Our

demands are perfectly fair. We are not asking for the moon. After all, in the

last decade, the number of managers has increased by more than 10%. Their salaries

have risen by a significant 18%. In contrast, our frontline workers, such as garage staff

and other essential personnel, saw only an 8 % increase in their wages. The cost of

living has surged by around 30%, placing a heavy financial burden on all of our

families. The disparity highlights a growing gap between management and those on the

front line. Managers in decision-making roles have received substantial

benefits and significant pay raises, even when their performance outcome might not align

with the organization's expectations. On the other hand, frontline workers continue to

work hard under strenuous conditions without commensurate compensation.

The critical issue here revolves around fairness and transparency. While management reaps financial rewards, frontline workers face stagnant wages and a rising cost of living without any necessary support. This situation not only affects individuals, but also their well-being

-being, but also has a broader impact on the efficiency and morale. Mark

Sutcliffe, our Mayor, has advocated for equitable distribution of resources and

funding. It follows then that OC Transpo should ensure that frontline workers

receive their fair share of support as well. I will now ask Mr. Manny Sforza,

our IVP from the International, to give us a bit of commentary on what may

have transpired yesterday in our first official day of bargaining. Manny.

All right. Good evening, everybody. Thanks for joining us. Thank you, Noah, for that

introduction and update. I want to begin by thanking everybody for their efforts and

their hard work. They do it day in and day out, moving everybody in the City of

Ottawa. I want to congratulate everybody who participated and signed the petition

to send a strong message to OC Transpo in the City of Ottawa that we mean

business, we're going to fight for a fair contract. We're not going to stop

or give up until we reach our goal. So, let's talk about yesterday's meeting. And before I talk 

about yesterday's meeting, Noah touched on the delay that, you know, the employer took in 

sitting down and meeting with us. It's my opinion that this was intentional, and I can say 

that with confidence because I've had the opportunity to meet with them and represent 

ATU 1760 at the bargaining table. And, you know, there didn't seem to be any problem 

getting dates when it came to that local. But for whatever reason, getting dates for your 

local and getting them to the table was extremely difficult.  I believe this was intentional 

because they saw the momentum we had, and they saw the internal

organizing, they saw the unity in the membership, and I believe they did it to try

to slow us down, but that's not going to happen. We all know that we're ready to

fight, and we're going to continue to fight. Yesterday at the bargaining table, you

know, the mood was professional and respectful, and that's the same as

it's been with our other ATU Local in Ottawa. You know, there are a lot of items. Your 

bargaining team and executive board have done an excellent job bringing proposals 

forward and representing the entire membership.

 I want to reassure everyone that when I'm at the bargaining table,

and I know your team has stated this over and over, that we want to get a deal

that represents everybody, you know, whether you're in transportation or maintenance or

in customer service, that we're there to work for you. You know,

I want to stop there and, with Noah, make some comments about how he felt things

went yesterday, and then we'll get into the questions right after that. Go ahead,

Noah.

Thank you, Manny. One thing I would really like to make abundant and clear to

everybody as best as I can. There are members who are inpatient,

and a lot of people want something to happen fast, like we've experienced in the

past. It's important to know that we've tabled a significant proposal,

not only for some of the items that are essential to us and to our membership, but also

a lot of smaller items that come to adjust language in a way that the collective

agreement is written to protect us going forward in the event that maybe

We get stuck with another long-term deal outside of this one. And that being said,

having been through the same language for so long, we've run into some walls, we've

had grievance and discipline issues, and that was the reason why this team and the

negotiating team sat to try to correct some of the language. And when you do

correction language in a CA, there's legalese, and it comes back to lawyers, both on

the city side and sometimes on our side, so it is not a surprise that we do run

into a little bit of a pause or a hesitancy when we go to discuss these matters.

The majority of yesterday's talk was on exactly that. It was on some of the clauses

that we wanted to address, and we made it clear that we did so, and it was very

important to me to make this message clear. We heard everything that the members put

forward. Our negotiating committee made a very strong effort to get information from

as many people from them as many departments as possible. And it was essential that

no matter what those issues were, they were at the very least brought to the table

, and that is what transpired yesterday. So yes, it's going to go slower. I'm okay

with it going slower if it means that we're going to be able to achieve everything

that we need to achieve. This bargaining committee, your negotiating strategy group

that helped get us to this point and the people at that table have every member's

best interest at heart. We won't settle for less than what we deserve. We will

absolutely fight for everything that we believe in. And if that takes time, then so

be it. It'll be a matter of getting it right, not getting it quick. That is

the mission we came to that table with, and we want to stick by that. So

there isn't a very large update to give other than to say that we are in the

process of bargaining now at this point, and we are anxious to continue this process, and 

we've been pushing for dates. The city is not pleased with our petition. They've

asked us several times for us to now change it. They've used two technicalities to

prevent us from being able to present it at the Transit Commission, and this is why

we are now faced where we will present it at Council, the way that the petitions

in the City of Ottawa are supposed to be. Since announcing that we were doing this,

the city has been reaching out to us. I've had Renee herself reach out to me

and ask me personally to pull back on it. I would like everybody on this call

and in the membership to know that very politely, we told Renee that there's no way

she's standing in the way of your voice. We intend to continue exactly with that

mentality going forward. They will not stop us and shut us up. We want better

service for ourselves and for our public, and our members are tired of being the

face of a failing service.

That's pretty much my update for now. I'm welcome to take questions at this point.

If the operator would be kind enough to start processing through that for us. Happy

to do it. Yeah, thank you. And folks, again, if you have a question to submit for

Q &A, press zero. We've already got Mustafa, Carl, Patty, and Curtis as well as

Frank in line. We're going to go to Carl first, who's asked to have his question

read, and then it looks like Mustafa and Curtis are good to go live. Let's see here.

Curtis's question is, are you planning on having proactive stipulations within the CBA

for future planning and schedule changes, so feedback is taken from more employees

aside from the planning department, due to how unrealistic the scheduling is and again,

That's from Carl. We share that frustration, Carl. Thank you very much. Our scheduling 

committee has been hitting a wall on a lot of these items as well, so they're not falling on

deaf ears with this question. It's difficult to get stipulations in there. There's

very rarely penalty language or whatnot. It is on the proposal.

It is something that we have brought forward. It's definitely something that is on

all of our radar. We do need more input. One of the things this board has done

from the beginning is institute these suggestions at atu279.ca direct email.

Everybody who reaches out on that line does get heard. It does get noted. When you

do have suggestions or concerns, particularly about runtime, we do take that in-house

for sure.  We strongly encourage that we use the SIR process. Over the

last several years, I know it's become a frustrating system in the sense that we've pushed

forward ideas and they've just fallen on deaf ears. But now with these new ways to

bus, as much as we may dislike it, it is an opportunity for a bit of a reset,

where we can start trying to work on these timelines. We are sharing the SIR

information that we get from members directly with the employer, and we are going to

be pushing all of those things as we have specific details. Another thing that we

have done that's very different is we've worked very hard and successfully worked our

way to have an executive board member,  Robin Dunbar, will be part of the scheduling

and planning department. He'll be inserted in there, like it was almost 15 years ago

under Craig Watson's presidency, when we had somebody that was directly working on the

run cuts themselves prior to it being sent out to the members. So proactively,

yes, we are working towards having more in place as far as language with

penalization becomes difficult, but we do have some in the proposal.

Thank you very much. Thank you, Noah. Appreciate you. Let's go to our next question.

This one comes to us live from Mustafa. Mustafa, welcome. Go ahead with your

question, please. Yeah, actually, good evening to everyone. My question is, I have a

couple of highlight questions. Like everything goes up, like Noah mentioned

earlier, about the cost of living, and our salary is still the same, and in my case, I'm a single-income person and I have to look for another job and no other to keep up with the payment and cost of living and expensive things and the other question that I have so quick is

what you're going to be done about that We have to watch for customers like a

child check seat to see if the customers are sleeping or like I feel myself I'm no

longer bus operator. I feel myself like I'm a school operator,

school bus operator or more likely like a babysitter. This is frustrating, as if we

don't have enough pressure on ourselves. Now we have to get out and check to see if

anything's sitting or sleeping, or if they have anything medical. I don't mind it, but I feel it's so frustrating. Also, I need to know what will be done about that booking, why we don't

take the buses from Basement Station instead of Lincoln Field Station.

We have a lot of places to park our vehicle over there instead of going to Lincoln

Field Station. And that's my concern right now. Okay. Well, I'll touch on the second one 

first, Mustafa. Thank you very much. As far as the relief points and the difference between 

the stations, there is definitely language in the proposal and language at the table, and the 

committees themselves have continuously been bringing these up to have relief points and 

Transfer points to be more practical for operators, whether that be parking or whether that 

be for a break location and facilities all of those things are on the radar specifically to 

Stations themselves. 

No, that's not in the proposal directly, but I can assure you that

people are working on that. To the first point, unfortunately, that's societal

change, and we're in a position of public service. Our obligation is to serve the

public, and we have to do so to the best of our ability and to the most

professional ability we have. And that's not something we have the ability to

necessarily control.

We have to follow the rules. Some people might find that frustrating. Some people

might find it a service to make sure that their buses are clear. I understand that

for you might be a frustration, but under the current situation, and given that

we've had a couple of situations here alone at OC Transpo, I think we absolutely

have to make sure that we're looking after the people that we represent and that we

get around town.

JJE, Joint Job Evaluation, is something that is in the proposal, that would affect, and that 

would help in matters when they add things to your job description. Anytime

there's an adjustment or addition to the job description, those kinds of things get

looked at and adjusted. We are the only OC transfer union that doesn't have it, so

that is being explored and that is proposed. I know it's not in the answer you

were looking for, Mustafa, but it is what we have.

Thank you, Noah. Thank you, Mustafa. Thank you. We've got Patty up next who's asking

to read her question. She's asking, "Would the poll out to the operators? What was

the amount of people who wanted a five-year contract as opposed to a three-year contract?

contract?" That one's from Patty.

Good evening, Patty. I don't have the specific numbers in front of me, other than to

tell you who is very overwhelming amongst the majority of everybody. There's no

appetite for anything longer than a three-year deal. We made that very clear at the

table yesterday. I can confirm that the desire on the employer's side is a longer

-a term deal than that, but we made our disinterest in that very known. And essentially

what was said was if it was to go longer than three years, it definitely has to

be more worth our while than they’re while this time around. So, we will see where

that leads us. But at this point, our proposal is for a three-year deal.

Thank you again, Noah. Thank you to Patty for the last question. Let's go right to

Chuck next. Chuck, thank you. What's your question for us?

I want to start off by saying thank you for taking my questions. I've got three

questions, and they're relatively quick. So, my first question is, how adamant is the

negotiating team against the block booking, even if it becomes very lucrative,

if the employer throws more than the expectation as far as salary, would this block booking 

be considered?

Well, the board itself is very adamant against block booking. I can say that I

can also tell you that block booking wasn't proposed. They called it roster, but 

you and I are both very aware what that really means to be honest Chuck We are

opposed to it regardless of how lucrative it gets that's not a that's easy thing to

say at this point what our board has said and where we're strategizing is we are

open to seeing what they have to offer. Once again, it was asked again yesterday,

probably the 10th time I've asked them, show me what it is you're talking about, and

they still can't produce it. And the point of that is I want to see it, and I want to

see what they want so that we can propose, or we can come up with something to

have the same solution to get to the same numbers. So, to answer your question quite

frankly, there's no appetite for block booking. The board stands with you, the

members on that.

Thank you again. Appreciate that. And that was from Chuck. Thank you to Chuck. We'll

go right to Curtis up next. Curtis, you're live. Go ahead, please, sir.

Yes, thanks again, guys, for having us today. So, my question today is based on the

10 sick days that the Canada Labour Code implemented back on 1 December 2022, to be

paid at 100%. Currently, we get the six days at 90 % and then lose our second week

of bank holidays after you use those up. Is there a plan to get the 10 sick days

paid at 100 %, and then have the union language changed so that we don't lose our

second week until after the 10th sick day is used. Thanks.

Thank you, Curtis. I'd like to say that, yes, the members of the maintenance side

of the negotiating committee definitely tabled that and definitely highlighted that as

an important issue that we needed to go going forward as far as the effect that it

has on your banking. As far as the top -up, the 100%,

there are reasons for that. It is already, it was already placed by the previous board

and we are pursuing it as well. There are also federal decisions and provincial

decisions that are set precedent. So, at this point it's just a matter of having an

arbitrator rule where that falls. And one of the hiccups with that is the fact that

we do have such a very generous and good sick day plan for the extent of the

maximum of 17 weeks that plays into it. So, there is some barriers there, but as I

said, there's some precedent that's already been set. You were very smart to point

out that there were already some rulings on it. So, at this point, it's a matter of

an arbitrator ruling how we will play it out on our system and have it implemented.

In the meantime, it is in the negotiation package, and it is a matter that has been

highlighted as important.

Excellent. Thank you again. Appreciate you, Noah. Thank you for that question. From

Curtis, we'll go to - this is from Vikram Jeet who's asked me to read them

question. Question is, in the contract agreement, what are the demands we have asked

for the union from the rail site? That's from Vikram Jeet.

At this point, we haven't specifically tabled anything specific regarding rail.

There are some issues that we obviously need to work on as we are only working off

MOAs and LOUs in the current system that we have now. I can tell you that both

parties are eager to address rail and one of the most significant outlining issues

around rail is, of course, the compensation. In all compensation, all money issues,

including benefits, both parties have agreed to table those at a later date in order

to continue the momentum and be able to continue with our negotiations before hitting

any kind of wall. So, there's, I can assure you that in the proposal that was

submitted, there are some significant changes to rail. And at this point,

since we haven't gotten into those discussions directly with them, I would prefer not

to detail them at this point, but rest assured that there are items in there that

are in just Many representatives and many operators were considered in the discussion

and all the comparables were made. But the desire is definitely to clean up the

language, get rid of LOUs and MOAs and create an actual package that addresses the

concerns specifically for rail ops, both the Aero and the Aero. As similar as they

may be and as unique as they are.

All right. Thank you again. Appreciate you, Noah. We are going right to Frank live

next. Hey, Frank, thanks for waiting your life. >> Yes. No, I know a lot of us

like to bitch and complain about the executive board, but whoever thought of this

idea on the phone has to be congratulated. Very good idea, and are we going to

continue doing this?

>> Thank you, Frank. I do appreciate that, and yes, absolutely. I don't think we'll

be doing this after every single bargaining round, but I can assure everybody on

this call and in the membership that if there is any a thing of significance, if

there's any news, any changes, or any important moves that we decide to make,

we will be doing these types of town halls and eventually maybe even including some

Zoom calls in order to keep everybody abreast and show full transparency. I do

appreciate it, Bill Frank, and the entire executive board and the committee suggested

this so I'm very proud of that group.

Thank you to Frank and we'll go to - we have a couple of folks asking the same

questions. Harpreet and Robert are both asking how much is the new pay rate that

we're suggesting? Robert's question, what hourly rate or percentage did we ask for?

I did touch on that in the last question. We are absolutely not tabling any

numbers, values, or percentages in the early stages of this, and that is both

parties have agreed to do so. And that is very common and typical of contract

negotiations. We try and get out as many of the matters that we can in the early

stages, agreed of as much as that we can, seeing as though usually those are the

two sticking points. So, they will be discussed at later dates, but at this point

that we're not prepared and we have been asked in that room point blankly and we

still haven't answered it in there. So, you're not being held out of any information.

And Noel, if I can just jump in and elaborate a little more. It's very common to

save the monetary until the end, when everything else has been dealt with.

So, when we deal with the language and working conditions, once all that is off the

table, then we will get into the benefits and, you know, your wages and things like

that. So, you know, that's not going to be for quite a few sessions. We have to

be upfront with that. And then just to get back to the previous question regarding

these calls, we appreciate that feedback and we'd like to be holding these calls on

a regular basis, whether it's monthly, every six weeks, whenever we find that there's

an opportunity to give you valid information and updates on the contract.

All right, thank you both, I appreciate you. And let's go right to our next caller.

This is from John. Hey John, thank you for waiting. Go ahead, please. Well, thank

you for taking my call. Good evening, Noah. I've got four quick questions.

I don't think they will take that long, but I was concerned. I was concerned with

who for management is representing their bargaining committee.

Well, on day one, they had a, what was it, 13 strong? They had somebody from one

department had from every single department and every part of LR, three members from

LR. So, in yesterday's it was more Chad and Rami because it was dealing directly

with transportation issues for the most part and they've made it clear that that's

what they'll do when we do specific days or blocks for specific issues. They'll have

the parties that are pertain to that specific issue present at the table.

All right, thank you, John. Let's go right to Troy up next here. Hey, Troy.

Go ahead, please. Hey. Good evening, Noah. Good evening, Manny. Thanks for holding

this. My question, if I'm allowed, is for Manny.

My understanding is, Manny, that you go to quite a few of the and agencies,

and you're quite involved in the contract negotiations. And my question is,

with this petition that we've signed and that we're going to present to city

council, in your opinion on the contracts that you've worked with,

how is the city in comparison to getting these strong contracts that are posted all

throughout the ATU magazine and you know online and stuff. What is your general

outtake and how does the city perceive those petitions when they get them from the

local unions? So that's a great question, thank you so much. You know I've said

over and over when I come to membership meetings and whether I am at a convention

speaking

Contracts that have campaigns connected to them and, you know,

I'm using the phrase campaign because, you know, the petition is just part of a

bigger campaign. There's so many actions and things like that. I can say with me

experience that we get stronger contracts when there's a campaign connected to a

contract negotiation. We saw it in Toronto. I've seen it in the other properties.

If you look at Toronto and the amazing work they did there, the same type of work

we're doing here in Ottawa; they got an excellent contract. And it sends a strong

message. And that's why there's so much pushback from the employer, because they know

that we've got the local, we've got membership working together in United.

And that's a threat. That's a threat to them. And that's a great sign. And that's

why I love the question so much. And again, we just have to keep putting pressure

on them. I hope we get a lot of people out at city council next Wednesday when

they're in your shirts. We did something like this in Toronto years ago when we had

people showing up from a committee every time there was a commission meeting to the

point where the mayor actually acknowledged them and said, oh, look, keep transit

public people are here again. So, it works, it sends a strong message. And, but,

you know, it's because of all the involvement from all of you. That's,

that's the whole point, right? We have to keep working together and we will fight

for a strong contract.

All right. Thank you again. We've got Brunsung up next. Brunsung,

welcome your live. Go ahead. Hey there, first, I want to commend this

meeting. I think this is a really great initiative. I have a couple of questions.

First of all, regarding the potential for Para-Transpo to join our collective,

would that mean siloed seniority or would that mean that the fair transfer operators

would get to fold into their seniority and fall into line with conventional? That

would be my first question. As the conversations have gone at this point it would

be considered a segregated group. It would just fall under our contracts. So similar

to garage attendance if you were to switch over to that position or fair inspectors

if you were to switch over to that position. So technically it would be siloed as

far as the seniority at PERA and our operator seniority would remain siloed. Got

that. Second question I got and last one here is related to Chuck's question earlier

about block booking.

If the city is unwilling to budge, I know that we're all ready to fight and we

don't want to if we don't have to. My question is, are we willing to combine to

try to find a way to compromise and combine a schedule put forth by the city that

is block booking? But that would enable us to look in a cafeteria style so we

could maybe combine our regular and our general spare booking. Any operator could

book their Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday separately. so

that senior operators could still have the days off that they prefer, the management

that have the block booking requirements that they require.

Yeah, that's a great question. I personally and as a board, we don't like to make

decisions without the proper information, yes or no. So, at this point, until they

actually, table what it is they're suggesting, until we actually get our hands on it

and have an idea of how it plays out, who it affects, and how it plays out long

term. We aren't in the interest of even negotiating on it, and we made that very

clear yesterday. They need to provide us what it is they're talking about so that

we can see if there's other ways to get to it, like you bring up. If there's

other ways to get to what they need, then we will find it, we will use the

necessary people and the necessary resources to get to that answer. But at this

point, they're talking about a subject that they're not willing to define or give

any definition to and that makes it very difficult to even consider. So, at this

point it's a dead note and until they give us something to work with, we have no

idea if we can adapt, if we can find alternatives and that is the desire. We want

to do what's best for everybody and if that is a variation of so be it but we

can't make a variation of nothing. So, until it's provided, there's nothing that we

can do.

All right. Thank you so much. Appreciate that. Let's go to John up next here. John,

you're live. Go ahead, sir.

John, are you there? Yeah, sorry about that. Yeah, hi. It's John 2503. I'm just

wondering, since the city taken us seriously that to come and talk to us.

Are you willing to do work to rule for a little while? Are we in that,

look we're allowed to do that now since we're in talks?

You're not allowed to do it while you're in talks. There are rules, there are laws

on how that process comes to be and I can assure you that we are definitely

checking off our T's and dotting our eyes for that process if we get to any kind

of stalemate. But there is a process. There are filings that have to be done with

conciliation. There is an entire waiting period and all of which has been explored,

discussed and if we get to a point where we need to stand up collectively and send

a message on, yes, this board, this membership, this committee and I do believe

every single member that's been here for any more than three to four years and even

some of the new ones are all willing to make that stand. And yes, everybody here

is willing to do it. We just have to make sure we do it properly.

All right. Thank you again to John. Let's go next to Ahmad.

Ahmad, you're live on the line. Go ahead, sir. Yes. Thank you, gentlemen, for this

opportunity. I commend the gentlemen got made this skill for us on the phone.

One question that I've been hearing all the time that is content with most of the

drivers, not all, but most of the drivers I spoke to is about the travel time.

The travel time from the depot and the travel time from the street back to depot.

There's lots of time, hours being spent for free,

while others who are like OCC transport management, they are paid the minute they

are at the parking lot. So is there any discussion or is it of the agenda of the

collective bargaining? Thank you. Thank you.

Yes, absolutely. Travel time is part of our proposal. Travel time was discussed

briefly yesterday. Travel time will be heavily discussed going forward. It is an

essential part of where we are trying to go with this contract. And I think it

came as a surprise to our IVP yesterday that it's not something that we've fought

for in the past. So, I think we will be fighting for it going forward.

Perfect. Thank you. Thank you, Amad. We'll go to Tyler live next. Tyler, thank you

for waiting. Go ahead. Hey, guys. I just want to thank all you for putting this

call together. I think it's been really good for a lot of people who can't

ordinarily attend meetings or other union activities. I really appreciate it. I know

a lot of other people do too. Just two really quick questions. Number one, in the

recent provincial election, Doug Ford said that he would upload OC transport under

provincial jurisdiction. I'm just wondering, is that something that we're using as

leverage in bargaining talks? And number two, I just want to piggyback off of

another caller's one of the first questions you guys got tonight. Just kind of

piggyback off of that gentleman's kind of sentiment in his question. I'm just

wondering, are we looking in any way here to kind of clean up some of the more

ambiguous kind of gray language in our CBA policies and internally, just the kind of

things that cover kind of I guess disciplinary matters. I think that's one of the

bigger stressors of the job, not knowing how certain situations kind of will pan out

based on subjective criticism down the road.

Tyler, I really appreciate that question because yes, that is a big part of what is

in the proposal. That is a big part of what our committee worked hard on trying to

work on language, and I agree with you 100%. That gray area, that those non

-descript words sometimes have led to many more problems, and it is a part of what

we are trying to attack here, and that really is also what is going to delay some

of these talks, and that is why I begged for patience in the beginning. When you

do change language, that takes time, but I do agree with agree with you, it's

essential that we get a lot of language changes. And yes, language around discipline

or language around timelines for discipline and how they need to be handed out and

or when it ends and expires. That is all language that we have in our proposal.

We've addressed the step process. We've addressed the RTAs. There's a lot of

different changes within the disciplinary part of the CA that we did bring to the

table. So yes, that is part of what will bog this down, but it is essential, and

I agree with you. Going forward, we need to clean a lot of that up, and I'm glad

that you brought that up. The first part of your question, if I could get you to

repeat it, would help, because it came off in my screen.

Oh, with the recent elections around Metrolinx. - Yeah. - I can touch on that, I can

touch on that, even if he's off the line. The around Metrolinx, from the beginning,

I went and talked with Mayor Sutcliffe and Wendy Stephenson, our city manager from

the moment that was announced as a as a party tool for Doug Ford.

That was definitely an election promise. Any details or how that plays out really

hasn't even been discussed and it doesn't look like it will be on any kind of

short -term plan, but we have made it clear that it has to be OC Transpo that

continues to run it. If they're looking at changing who the third party is in that

contract, so be it. But it continues to be OC Transpo, and it absolutely continues

to be 279 members. So hopefully that answers your question. We are aware of it,

we are at the table with it. It doesn't affect bargaining per se other than we

we're trying to protect language and contracting out and scope of work.

- All right, thank you again. And folks, we've got a little more than 10 Just about

10 minutes left here, so we're going to keep taking questions right up to the end,

but we will also be providing a recording of this forum to you by e -mail tomorrow.

And at the end of the forum, if we don't get your question, there's still something

you need support with. Feel free to stay on the line and leave a voicemail message

for Noah and the rest of the team here. Tara, you're live. Go ahead, please. Hi,

Noah. Thanks for doing this for all of us. Two quick questions. The first one I

just wanted to know let's say if we get everything that we want with this contract

and it looks good for everybody should we be worried that the city might try to

use like layoffs like kind of like to fight back against us for getting everything

we want and in saying we have no money and then the second question is I know

I've been here almost 10 years, and I know that the work has work has gotten pretty

bad to the point that I finished out like, let's say, Rideau, right, like on the

number 12 or something. Do you think maybe in your negotiations, you can try to get

like more work where it's like maybe finishing with the bus, a little bit less on

the street, like there seems to be a lot of stuff on the street. And it seems to

be a lot of stuff where it's like six and a half, seven hours, more for like the

10Ks, maybe the 9 ,000s, but it would be nice to see more eight hours, like a

regular eight hours or maybe a little bit more because I'm not sure about everybody

else, but I can't live off like six and a half, seven hours a day.

Thank you, Tara. There is language in the proposal that addresses all of those

items, as far as the intention to schedule is close to seven and a half and eight,

and to get bigger pieces. That is all addressed in there. I've already raised

that concern about a Rideau Center time point coming creeping back into the system

as a very serious safety issue as far as I'm concerned and I've already spoken to

Sabrina Pasian, the safety director about that. So that is on the radar. Those

things are being discussed even outside of negotiations. But as far as the shifts

and whatnot, yes, there is language in a lot of references that and tries to make

changes to that. As far as the layoffs, we've heard that every single time there's

ever been any round of bargaining, any time that it ever comes up. We've always

been short. We will always be short. We can't keep employees. We can't keep drivers

because we don't pay them enough and we don't treat them properly. So, retention is

a problem. Acquiring is a problem. It was said yesterday, it's meeting that it's

believe they feel they may even still be 50 to 100 drivers short. So, I would like

to put your mind at ease in that regard. If you do hear that threat, I think you

should stick with what we've always said, it's just not true. They can't get rid of

people. They need people, the service demands people. As far as garage to garage,

that's always going to be an issue when we run into the problems that we're running

into now with a shortage of buses. It's gotten worse over time because of the

shortage of buses, until we get an influx of operational funding, which we're

fighting very desperately to get, so we can go out and purchase more diesel buses

and get away from this electric program. Until we get more buses, we won't be able

to improve the work as far as garage to garage, but that's why it is also

essential that we talk about travel time.

- Thank you again, Noah. Let's go right to our next one coming from Troy. Hey Troy,

welcome, go ahead. Hey, sorry, another quick question for Manny. Manny,

what is ATU International and ATU Canada's stance? If by chance,

you know, we should have to do that five -letter S word and we end up in front of

the federal Labor Minister Stephen McKinnon. What is the ATU's outtake on how things

would go that way? And, you know, are they prepared to fight against Stephen

McKinnon, the Labor Minister?

Well, thanks for that question. And I think the five -letter word you were referring

to was strike, I would imagine.

So, you know, there's a lot of different options, you know, first and foremost the

international I'm the international. I'm when I'm in the room, you know,

I'm there representing international president John Costa in the event that things

don't go well and We do end up on a strike then there's financial compensation for

everybody, you know, and there's a weekly payment for everybody, but I don't want to

get too far into that. As far as a legal challenge, absolutely.

The international is always there to assist in fights. And,

you know, again, if we're in a legal strike position, it's hard to say how they're

reacting. You know, I appreciate the question

The strikes in history in this town, they've always been long strikes for whatever

reason, but You know, I've been on one strike and that was with Metrolinx

incidentally and

It was all over contracting out -and -job protection. We actually went on strike for

that So I know I'm deviating a bit from your question, but there will be support

on the ground.

We've had a lot of strike threats in Canada over the last few years and the U.S.

And in the event, we get there, I can assure you, International President John Costa

will be on a flight to get into town, and this local will get all the support it

needs if we ever get there.

All right. Thank you again. Appreciate you, Manny. And we'll go right to Abdi next.

Abdi, your live. Go ahead. Hi, everyone. Thank you for taking my question. Just a

question regarding any proposals towards pension and benefits?

Anything that we're tabling to ask for more in those, in those subjects.

Yeah, absolutely. Andy, thank you for the question. The, the proposal definitely will

have, and I say will because it hasn't been presented yet because that will fall

under monetary to the end, but it does have significant adjustments and changes to

the current plan. It has new asks. It's all been done through our consultants, and

it was surprising to learn that it has been difficult to even achieve some of the

matching things that have gone along the way just because of the way our contract

with the city was written. So, it was surprising to our consultants to learn that we

were behind on a few items, so some things will be easier table than others, but

we do have a significant package that was given to us by the consultants at Coughlin,

our new consultants here at ATU, and we definitely are prepared up to and including

issues around pension and benefits, working past the age of 65,

and then even how it affects pensioners. So, all of that stuff is within us

proposal. It just has not been tabled yet, so it wouldn't be right to talk about

it publicly at this point now.

Got it. Thank you again. Appreciate you. And thank you, Abdi and Noah. We are just

about out of time here, but I just wanted to remind you that we ran a poll

earlier. I'll go ahead and run it again in case you didn't get a chance to vote

in it. We were asking, will you be able to attend the upcoming City Council meeting

at 10 a.m. on Wednesday, May 28 at City Hall? Go ahead and Press 1 for yes,

you can't attend, 2 for no, and 3 for maybe. And please remember that if you're

scheduled to work during this time, you should not attend. So again, are you able

to join the upcoming City Hall meeting, City Council meeting at 10 a.m. on

Wednesday, May 28 at City Hall? Press 1 for yes, 2 for no, 3 for maybe, and while

we get our last votes on that; I will turn it back over to Noah to take us to

the close here.

Thank you, Kylie. I'd just like to reiterate how much I appreciate people taking the

time out of their family lives and their busy days to tune into this. I appreciate

the compliments and that we set this up and I definitely will be doing it. We will

be doing it going forward. It's very important, again, I want everybody to understand

this will be a process and it's important that we take the time necessary to get

it right. How long that takes won't matter if we get the deal that we need for

the people that we represent, and that is our goal here. It's very important also,

being able to discuss things with the board and /or our committee is not limited to

just these phone calls and these town halls. The suggestions@atu279.ca email is

available to anyone at any time, and it is always answered as soon as we possibly

can. So, if you have other things that you thought of that you would like answers

to. I do encourage everybody once again to go ahead and use that email address, and

we look forward to getting with everybody again at the next opportunity that we

have. I know that there were some people that weren't able to get in on this call.

I do trust that speaking about this call and what was spoken about on this call

will get out pretty quickly, if not by the end of the evening until tomorrow

anyway, but I'm actually encouraging people to do so, please. Let's get people out

there is aware of what was discussed tonight and let's try and squash some of the

rumors versus facts. And again, encourage everybody to reach out to those suggestions

email or to any of our board members or the people on the committee if they have

questions. We are very transparent, we will continue to be transparent, and I'll take

the opportunity one more time to thank everybody and remind everybody that we ride

together, we are stronger together and we are proud to be ATU 279.